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Slack founder: Mental models for building products people love ft. Stewart Butterfield

In this insightful conversation, Stewart Butterfield, the visionary behind Slack and Flickr, shares hard-earned wisdom from his journey building transformative products. Moving beyond the usual startup narratives, he dives into the subtle yet powerful mental models that shape effective leadership and product innovation.
Butterfield emphasizes that not all friction in design is bad—when it enhances comprehension, it can be valuable. He introduces the S-shaped utility curve to illustrate how user value evolves with effort, helping teams identify when a feature becomes indispensable. A key challenge he highlights is the 'owner’s delusion,' where creators misjudge their product's clarity due to personal bias, underscoring the need for empathy and external feedback. He advocates for continuous dissatisfaction as a driver of improvement, citing Slack’s early public critique as a catalyst for growth. The discussion also covers hyper-realistic work-like activities—busywork that emerges in scaling organizations—and the importance of eliminating such inefficiencies. Pivoting, he argues, requires balancing intuition with rational analysis, detaching emotionally to make objective decisions. Finally, Butterfield champions generosity in leadership, framing cooperation through game theory and stressing long-term value over short-term wins, while remaining vigilant about sustainability.
06:44
06:44
The first effort may yield little value, then there's a threshold for high value, and further investment has diminishing returns.
10:13
10:13
Users' rising standards require ongoing product refinement to maintain satisfaction.
18:13
18:13
At Slack, 'tilting your umbrella' is seen as an opportunity.
22:15
22:15
The 'Shouty Rooster' pop-up effectively reduced misuse of @everyone in Slack.
40:15
40:15
Simplifying menus improves experience more than reducing clicks
45:11
45:11
Successful product leaders are constantly unsatisfied with how products work
47:14
47:14
Direct criticism can be motivational when aimed at improvement
50:10
50:10
Almost nothing works because there are too many vetoes in modern systems.
1:00:25
1:00:25
The cost of implementing a feature exceeded its possible benefit, making it a guaranteed loss.
1:12:06
1:12:06
We don't sell saddles here — we sell the experience of riding.
1:13:23
1:13:23
Admitting a pivot is often humiliating because you have to convince people you were wrong.
1:18:36
1:18:36
Generosity in business is both a personal value and a strategic advantage.